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 Post subject: What or who are "Colossus and Guardian"...?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2013 9:43 pm 
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If you think it's bad now just wait until Colossus and Guardian* get their act together.

*You see kids, before Skynet became the buzzword, there was this fun little book by D.F. Jones...


What or who are "Colossus and Guardian"...?

You young smart guys keep throwing these new things at an old man, who has absolutely no idea about what you are talking about. I'm thinking about giving FrankC a call to see if he can explain "Colossus and Guardian" to me. :lol:

p.s. What the Hell is "Skynet"? What kind of dumb buzzword could it be? Who is D.F. Jones? Please tell me what his little fun book is called, and what it is about. :D

p.p.s. I know what a drag it must be to try to teach old farts stuff that they probably won't understand anyway. :lol:

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 Post subject: For most people, mutual funds are the best way to invest...
PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2013 10:34 pm 
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For most people, mutual funds are the best way to invest... I know that some of you stock market geniuses will tell me that is nonsense, and the fees mutual funds charge make them a bad way to invest.

I don't agree, and am waiting for someone to argue that selective stock picking is the way to go. :D

p.s. If tomorrow will allow me, I will try to post the best advice any of you young people have ever had on how to manage your retirement fund.

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 Post subject: Re: What or who are "Colossus and Guardian"...?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 9:39 pm 
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Cloudy wrote:
spotes wrote:
If you think it's bad now just wait until Colossus and Guardian* get their act together.

*You see kids, before Skynet became the buzzword, there was this fun little book by D.F. Jones...


What or who are "Colossus and Guardian"...?

You young smart guys keep throwing these new things at an old man, who has absolutely no idea about what you are talking about. I'm thinking about giving FrankC a call to see if he can explain "Colossus and Guardian" to me. :lol:

p.s. What the Hell is "Skynet"? What kind of dumb buzzword could it be? Who is D.F. Jones? Please tell me what his little fun book is called, and what it is about. :D

p.p.s. I know what a drag it must be to try to teach old farts stuff that they probably won't understand anyway. :lol:


Answer posted in "Obscure movies..." thread


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 Post subject: Good Lord willing...
PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 12:51 am 
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Good Lord willing, if I can find the time in a day or two (Got a lot of things going on.), I will teach all of you young folks a way to manage your retirement accounts. There will be NO Cloudy joking about this. I won't be trying to sell you anything, but an idea. Looking back to 1974, when I got into this business, I think I have the best long term approach to the market there is. It is extremely simple, and if history is correct, it will work over the long haul, which is what you young folks have working for you.

p.s. Old farts can disregard what I will have to say. Time has run out on us, and it's too late for us to try to follow what I will suggest, because it takes more time to work than what we have left. :lol:

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 Post subject: This will be a long one...
PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 10:09 pm 
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This will be a long post, even by my standards, but I promised it, and will do my best to deliver what I promised...

The stock market is very unpredictable. However, that unpredictability actually offers young people, who have many years to go before retirement a way to do well over the long term in their traditonal or Roth IRAs, Keoghs, SEPs, 401(k)s, 403(b)s, etc. Most of these plans offer investors the ability to use mutual funds, which I believe is the way to go. However, which mutual funds...?

There are gazillions of mutual funds to choose from, but I will try to break them down to just a few for the long term retirement plan investor. Steer clear from specialty funds, no matter how sexy they might look. Go into very basic mutual funds, no matter how boring they may look.

Here are the basic mutual fund types that I would advise the long term retirement investor to put their money into:

1-Large Cap Growth
2-Large Cap Value
3-Small Cap Growth
4-Small Cap Value
5-International

(I have eliminated Bond Funds and Money Market Funds, because they will never get a young person where they need to be by retirement. I have also eliminated Specialty Funds, because of the high risk involved. I skipped mid caps, because I wanted to keep this simple, and I ignored micro caps, for obvious conservative reasons.)

Yep, just five to keep it simple.

Put 20% of your retirement investment money equally into the five different types of mutual funds I have listed above, and leave them alone for a year, no matter what happens or what you read or hear. When the year is over some will have done well, and some will have not done well. However, don't worry things will change, they always do. At the end of the year rebalance all of the five mutual funds back to 20%. Yep, that will mean selling off a portion of your winners and putting that money into your losers. This is what is called selling high and buying low. However, not with all of your money, because last year's winners could be winners again next year, and last year's losers could be losers again. However, history tells us that the winners will not stay on the top forever, and losers will not stay at the bottom either. Things change, and when they do you will benefit from having moved money from mutual funds that were high and putting it into mutual funds that were low, when they reverse. Yes, the fund types I've recommended will switch around, but in no predictable fashion. They will take their turns being the best place to be and being the worst place to be, but over time my plan will work out, if you have the years to let it. :D

This is not just a one year plan. It is an every year plan. Yep, every year rebalance all of these five mutual funds back to 20% each, no matter what your hear on the Internet, read in Money Magazine, Business Week, The New York Times, anything that you hear on TV, or what your latest broker or smart friends tell you. Stay with the plan, through bull markets, bear markets, market crashes, market panics, market mania, etc. Stay the course, and I think you will come out a winner...!

I will be long dead before you youngsters, who follow this plan will realize what good advice I have given you. However, if you ever have the chance, try to find where they have buried me, and pour a beer or perhaps some Makers Mark on my grave. I might just rise up from the dead and thank you for the drink, or you might just want to thank me for the advice. :lol:

p.s. I need to add, as one starts getting close to retirement, where they will need this money to live on, they should probably start looking at more conservative, reliable, income producing investments, whatever they might be so many years from now. This should be considered five to three years out, before you need to depend on your investments to provide you with income before you die, as well as those, who are dependent on you are still alive.

p.p.s. Most retirement plans offer a family of mutual funds that include all five of the fund types I have recommended, and within the family of funds there are no fees or charges to move money between them.

p.p.p.s. Ask your broker to give you what is often called "The Periodic Table Chart of Investment Returns" (Because it resembles the Periodic Table of Elements.) Make your broker do some work. You don't want just the last ten years, he can dig up older ones that go back a lot farther, which will open your eyes to what I am saying. Once you see them YOU WILL KNOW THAT I'M RIGHT...!!!

Here is just one of many such charts that I am talking about:

Image

p.p.p.p.s. This post is only for members of the "ScaRatings" and their immediate families to use for free. If anyone takes it and tries to make money on my wisdom selling it to others, without my consent, I probably won't sue you, but I will be very disappointed in you. :lol:

p.p.p.p.p.s. Don't try to outsmart my program, no matter how smart you are. Though some, who try to wing it on their own, will be right every now and again, and do well for a while, they will not do well over the long haul.

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Last edited by Cloudy on Fri Nov 22, 2013 10:31 pm, edited 8 times in total.

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 Post subject: I am surprised that..;.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2013 11:40 pm 
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I am surprised that nobody has taken me to task, and told me that I am a fool after my previous lengthy post. Perhaps that is because the smart guys might think I'm right, :lol: or perhaps it's because it would take weeks of research to find data that would contradict what I have said. :lol:

Anyway you look at it...

................................................... Image

................................................................. "Goodnight I'm going to bed."

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 Post subject: Don't confuse genious...
PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 11:53 pm 
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(This advice is for those of you, who have done very well speculating in and trading stocks over the past few years.)

Your speculating and trading results are probably looking pretty good today. However...

"Don't confuse genius with a bull market."

You are riding the crest of a wave, and at some point the wave will break.

When the stock market is at all-time highs is the time to start being concerned, because even though over the long haul the market will rise, it's not ever going to be a straight up graph. There will be corrections, bear markets, and crashes out there to get you. Be careful and don't get greedy, at some point it is best to leave something on the table and walk off a winner. Of course it will go higher after you take your profits. If it couldn't there would be no one there to buy the stocks from you. Let someone else have them, and they can try to guess where the top is. Trying to guess where the top is to get out, is something you should probably avoid.

p.s. This bit of advice does NOT apply to those (if any), who might be following my long term retirement plan in mutual funds program posted above. It is for those, who have been dealing in individual stocks, and now consider themselves stock market geniuses for how their portfolios have been growing.

p.p.s. When good news about the stock market starts finding its way from the financial page to the front page of your newspaper, it's time to get worried. :lol:

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 Post subject: The "Greed Factor"...
PostPosted: Mon Dec 23, 2013 1:50 am 
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The "Greed Factor" is a problem. Everything you have been doing in the stock market has been making you money. All of your stock selections have been going up. You have great profits "on paper", and you don't want to cut those profits short by selling too soon. You think they might go a whole lot higher, and you want to ride them to the top, before you sell them.

"Paper Profits" are not money in the bank. They are ephemeral.

I have some suggestions as how to overcome the "Greed Factor", lock in profits, and perhaps still participate on the upside in stocks you love, after you have sold them, and have transferred your paper profit to real dollars in the bank.

Because I think very few of you (if any) are interested in what my suggestions are, I'm not going to waste more of my time on this.

However, if someone is interested in my suggestions, please feel free to send me a Private Message, and I will be more than happy to share my ideas with you.

p.s. Now that I am no longer in the investment business to earn a livelihood, my advice is totally free, and I will never make a penny off of anyone, who listens to me.

p.p.s. This post should be disregarded by any of you (if any), who might be following my long term mutual fund retirement plan for young people. It's for the wheeler dealers... :lol:

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 Post subject: Look out for religious investment advisors...
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 4:42 am 
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Over my many years in the business I have met a number of people, who were lured into investment relationships with people, who claimed that they had a religous system to investing that would make them rich. None of them had a good experience.

Recent radio advertisements, that I keep hearing, prompted me to make this post. In particular it is Sean Hyman's "Biblical Money Code".

Here's a link to how the sale's presentation goes:

http://w3.newsmax.com/newsletters/uwr/v ... _codea.cfm

When someone tells you that they have a plan from God to make you money, then asks you for your money... RUN...!

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 Post subject: How much did the government lose on the GM bailout...?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 18, 2014 2:23 am 
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How much did the government lose on the GM Bailout...?

Answer: Ten and a half billion dollars.

Does GM look like a good buy now? I say no, because the basic poblems that took GM to the brink of bankruptcy were never addressed after the government's take over. This has nothing to do with GM's ability to make good cars. The problem remains with the extremely expensive union worker pay, medical benefits, and retirement programs. I feel that it is just a matter of time before these things force GM into bankruptcy again.

For those of you who say, "The country can't allow General Motors to go out of business." My answer is that bankruptcy would not mean that General Motors would shut their doors, and all of their employees would go on unemployment. What it would mean is that all of the shareholders would see their stock become worthless, new owners would take over, and the overly generous union contracts would no longer exist. The new owners would keep the assembly lines running, and the old workers could continue in their jobs, if they wanted to, but at a much more reasonable expense to GM. General motors cannot compete in the international market unless these things change.

(Let's see how much trouble this gets me into.)

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 Post subject: Radio investment advice programs that are really...
PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2014 11:38 pm 
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There are many investment advice programs on the radio today, that are really little more than sales presentations by the experts, who get hours to explain to listeners why they should invest their money with them. (Lately, most of them seem to focus on precious metals.) What really disturbs me, is that none of them that I have listened to actually give good, balanced investment advice. The frightening thing is that many people, who listen to these programs, will think that they are getting sound investment advice, because they heard it on a program on a radio station that they trust for information.

Something should be done to put a stop to this deceptive sales practice.

Though I don't know, I would have to guess that these fast talking shysters probably pay the radio stations, that put them on the air, pretty good money to get the time that the radio stations give them to push what they have to sell.

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 Post subject: Re: Radio investment advice programs that are really...
PostPosted: Fri May 02, 2014 2:43 pm 
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Cloudy wrote:
There are many investment advice programs on the radio today, that are really little more than sales presentations by the experts, who get hours to explain to listeners why they should invest their money with them. (Lately, most of them seem to focus on precious metals.) What really disturbs me, is that none of them that I have listened to actually give good, balanced investment advice. The frightening thing is that many people, who listen to these programs, will think that they are getting sound investment advice, because they heard it on a program on a radio station that they trust for information.

Something should be done to put a stop to this deceptive sales practice.

Though I don't know, I would have to guess that these fast talking shysters probably pay the radio stations, that put them on the air, pretty good money to get the time that the radio stations give them to push what they have to sell.


A good start would be to turn the radio off. :D

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 Post subject: Actually, I think the SEC should turn them off..
PostPosted: Mon May 05, 2014 12:42 am 
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SEKA wrote:
A good start would be to turn the radio off. :D


Actually, I think the SEC (Securities Exchange Commission) should turn the radio off. What these charlatans say on the radio are thinly veiled sales presentations that violate SEC rules that apply to traditional brokerage, investment firms, that the SEC would never allow to say anything close to what these radio programs get away with.

Believe me, I know after 32 years of Merrill Lynch compliance people monitoring and regulating eveything I said, every letter I sent to clients, any presentations I made at an investment seminar, with the fear that the SEC would find that I had glossed over possible risks and had exagerated possible returns, that I could never have made presentations to people anything close to what these radio shows do.

Many, if not most, of these radio investment shows seem to lack the ethics that I lived by, and just want to sell people what they are pushing, without any regard as to if what they have to sell is appropriate for their victims or not.

Where is the SEC on these violations to it's rules...?

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 Post subject: Re: Actually, I think the SEC should turn them off..
PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2014 9:11 am 
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Cloudy wrote:
SEKA wrote:
A good start would be to turn the radio off. :D


Actually, I think the SEC (Securities Exchange Commission) should turn the radio off. What these charlatans say on the radio are thinly veiled sales presentations that violate SEC rules that apply to traditional brokerage, investment firms, that the SEC would never allow to say anything close to what these radio programs get away with.

Believe me, I know after 32 years of Merrill Lynch compliance people monitoring and regulating eveything I said, every letter I sent to clients, any presentations I made at an investment seminar, with the fear that the SEC would find that I had glossed over possible risks and had exagerated possible returns, that I could never have made presentations to people anything close to what these radio shows do.

Many, if not most, of these radio investment shows seem to lack the ethics that I lived by, and just want to sell people what they are pushing, without any regard as to if what they have to sell is appropriate for their victims or not.

Where is the SEC on these violations to it's rules...?

Have you lodged a complaint with the SEC?

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 Post subject: Do you think the SEC might listen to me...?
PostPosted: Sun May 11, 2014 12:21 am 
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pengwn wrote:
Have you lodged a complaint with the SEC?


Do you think the SEC might listen to me...? These violations are so flagrant, that there is no way the SEC should need my help to become aware of them. Is it that the Securities and Exchange commission doesn't want to be bothered with having to deal with radio program charletons, or is there some quirk in the law that prevents the SEC from shutting these bastards down?

PENGWN, I might just actually take your advice, and start reporting the thinly veiled investment sales presentations on the radio that violate SEC rules to them.

I doubt that anything will come of it, but I'm gonna do it...

Thanks PENGWN... :D

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 Post subject: Re: Do you think the SEC might listen to me...?
PostPosted: Thu May 15, 2014 3:51 pm 
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Do you think the SEC might listen to me...?
Might. Might not. But I guarantee if you're not squawking, they ain't listening (That's the NSA's department)

These violations are so flagrant, that there is no way the SEC should need my help to become aware of them. Is it that the Securities and Exchange commission doesn't want to be bothered with having to deal with radio program charletons, . . .
It wouldn't surprise me. What's the fun of being a bureaucrat if you've gotta work all the time?

or is there some quirk in the law that prevents the SEC from shutting these bastards down?
I haven't the foggiest about American finance law

PENGWN, I might just actually take your advice

:o

Image

;)

Really, though, if you can be bothered to take the time to log in and complain about something to neutral parties online, it stands you reason you can also be bothered to make the effort and complain to the folks charged with addressing the problem

Unless they ask you to please hold
Image

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 Post subject: A difficult time to invest money...
PostPosted: Mon Jul 07, 2014 12:28 am 
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It is a difficult time to invest money. The stock market is at an all time high. I seached for the average price to earnings ratio (P/E ratio) for the S&P 500 today, and I came up with that it is about 20 times earnings. (This could be wrong.) Traditionally, a P/E multiple above 12 for established companies is a warning that they are over priced.

The stock market may very well keep going up, but buying stocks at these prices and P/E ratios is NOT buying low, and in the past has ultimately proved to be foolhardy.

Investing in bonds these days, with interest rates at all time lows, is financial suicide. When interest rates go up, as they eventually will, you will get your head handed to you.

Precious metals are no bargin these days. They are at all-time highs, and can be very volatile. Plus they pay no dividends or interest, and normally cost you storage fees to have them held in safe keeping. (Taking delivery of precious metals puts you at risk of having them stolen, added costs for delivery, and more costs to send them back after selling them and paying assay fees.)

So what in the world can you do with your money today? This may turn out to be bad advice, but I think it might be time to start takiing your profits in the the stock market and precious metals. (Don't sell it all, just start backing out.) Don't put a penny of your profits into the bond market.

Back to "what in the world can you do with your money today?" This might sound strange coming from a former stockbroker, but I would suggest that the profits you take from investments, that have gone sky high, might be best moved to money markets, short term CDs, and better yet paying off any debt you might have.

(Disclaimer: Please do not take any action on what I have posted until you have consulted your investment advisor and CPA.)

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Last edited by Cloudy on Fri Jul 11, 2014 12:30 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Stock Market Central
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 8:45 pm 
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Or if you are a farmer, you could put in the "barn bank."

For those who are agriculturally challenged, a barn bank is a dirt slope leading to a high barn door.


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 Post subject: Please forgive me...
PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2014 12:44 am 
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pengwn wrote:
Really, though, if you can be bothered to take the time to log in and complain about something to neutral parties online, it stands you reason you can also be bothered to make the effort and complain to the folks charged with addressing the problem

Unless they ask you to please hold

Image


Please forgive me. Sometimes I cannot avoid being absent from the "ScaRatings" for prolonged times, and after those times that I am absent, it is very difficult to catch up with what has transpired while I was gone.

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 Post subject: My previous concern about the stockmarket...
PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2014 1:16 am 
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My previous concern about the stockmarket was particulary directed at old people like I am. Even though the value of their stock and mutal fund holdings today make them feel like they have nothing to worry about in retirement, those valuations can change, and sometimes they can change dramatically in the wrong direction. At this point I would suggest that older people, who have a substantial amount of their life savings in stocks, call their investment advisors to discuss how a major pull back in the market would effect them in their retirement.

You younsters can do what you want, because if the stock market goes down a lot, you still have time on your side. However, if you have parents or grandparents, who might not be able to take a hit, you might want to talk to them.

Here's a chart of the Dow Jones Industrial average since 2000:

Image

(Once again price to earnings ratios are critical to consider, when you are invested in the stock market.)

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 Post subject: No comments... I guess you guys must be laughing me off...
PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2014 11:40 pm 
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No comments... I guess you guys must be laughing me off...

Here is a bit of wisdom:

"Don't confuse genious with a bull maket."

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 Post subject: Out of curiostiy...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 1:24 am 
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Out of curiosity, what are you guys and gals invested in today, and what is your investment strategy? In the unlikely event that anyone will respond to this, I will say that depending on your age and personal circumstances, I would expect very different answers to my question.

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 Post subject: Money is money, not...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 1:24 am 
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Money is money, not a number at the bottom of your investment statement.

When you buy securities with your money, you no longer have that money. You have converted it to securities that have a fluctuating value. It will only become money again, when you convert it back.

You can't pay for things with the current value of your investment statement, you can only pay for things with actual money. Whatever it might be, being able to pay for things is how we survive, and better yet enjoy life.

I have listened to so many people, who are giddy about how wealthy they have become after reading their latest investment statement. Many of them think this is a permanent situation. It isn't...! This wealth is only on paper, and can disappear very quickly, if the value of their investments go the wrong way. When the time comes that they need to convert the value of their securites back to actual money to buy and pay for things, it could very well be at the wrong time.

These comments are directed mostly at older people, who are retired, or who are getting close to retiremnt. Right now you old farts are sitting on top of the world with your investment portfolios, but because of your age, you are not in a position to screw up, and wait it out for things to get good again.

(You young guys and girls can do whatever you want to, because if you screw up, you've got years for things to recover.)

p.s. As usual, DO NOT TAKE ANY ACTION ON WHAT I HAVE POSTED WITHOUT CONSULTING A CPA AND INVESTMENT ADVISOR FIRST.

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Last edited by Cloudy on Tue Jul 29, 2014 2:08 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Time to be concerned...
PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 3:28 am 
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(This advice is not for young folks with 30 or more years to go before retirement. They should stick with my previously described long term 5 mutual funds annual rebalancing discipline.)

This is a time for those of you, who are actively playing the stock market with money you cannot afford to lose, to be concerned.

The price to earnings ratio of stocks and the indexes they comprise is something that must be considered when you look at your portfolio. Traditionally the P/E ratio for the S&P 500 has been somewhere around 12 times earnings, and anything above that is an indication that established stocks might be overpriced. Holding or buying these stocks above this P/E ratio could be rationalized by the expectation that the economy is going to grow and corporate earnings will increase to justify the higher P/E ratio. Today the P/E ration for the S&P 500 is somewhere around 20 times earnings. This makes me very concerned. If the economy doesn't grow and corporate earnings don't increase any time soon, a significant market correction could be something to be worried about. If this should happen and you are in a personal financial situation where this would be devastating to you, I strongly suggest that you consult your trusted investment advisor and discuss it with him or her.

There are reasons why the S&P 500 has been supporting a P/E ratio around 20 times earnings, but I feel that we may treading on the thin ice now.

Of course my concerns may be wrong, but find the time to talk about what I have said with your trusted investment advisor just the same. :D

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 Post subject: I'm concerned about the Fed increasing interest rates...l
PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2015 10:33 pm 
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I'm concerned about the Fed increasing interest rates, even though there doesn't appear that the economy is starting to grow too fast, and that most would not think that inflation could become a problem any time soon. However, the Fed might think differently. They have been hinting that they are considering a rate hike, and if the Fed feels like inflation is likely to spring up, they could very well increase interest rates as a preemptive move to head inflation off before it gets started. If and when they do this, it will not bode well for stocks or bonds. Even though I don't think there is actually any good reason to raise interest rates at this time, I worry that there might be some political reason behind this. (A little bit of my paranoia.) With the stock market acting as jittery as it has recently, I would suggest caution for those, who are invested in stocks at this time.

p.s. When the Fed increases interest rates, all interest rates go up, including the rates on treasury issues, which has to be paid on our national debt. (The treasury isn't paying any of this debt off. It is only increasing.) It will be a nightmare, when rates go up, when you consider the 18 trillion dollars of debt (And ever growing) that treasury already has to pay interest on. We're squeaking by with interest rates at all-time lows. However, when interest rates go up, as I guarantee they will eventually do, I find it hard to figure out how the government will be able to come up with the money to pay the interest on the debt, without drastically cutting what it spends on other things, such as the military, social services, the highway system, and everything else. Some may suggest that our country can handle this by increasing taxes. That's a bad idea. It will only aggravate the problem by killing growth in our economy. We could continue to keep raising the national debt ceiling, and borrow more money from China and other counties, but that is just digging us into an ever deeper hole, that the United States will ultimately be buried in. Unless our government stops spending money it does not have, ultimately it will have to default on the debt. Yep, the United States will go bankrupt. Thank God I'm old, and I'm hoping that I die before that happens.

Where is Milton Friedman when you need him...? I must also say that I hope that John Kenneth Galbraith is having fun in Hell giving long winded mandatory lectures on liberal economic theory to the others, who have also been condemned to dwell there for all eternity to pay for their sins.

Oh, there is another way out. The government could simply devalue the dollar so it's only worth 50 cents. However, that would be really bad for everyone, and if our government's irresponsible spending of money it doesn't have keeps going the way it is, the devaluation maneuver would only be a short-lived postponement of the total financial collapse of the United States.

p.s. There is hope though...! Actually, there are better ways to get out of all of this. The spiral death spin the country is in, plummeting towards a really bad landing, that no one will walk away from alive, can be corrected, as long as we don't take too long. However, this post has gone way too long, and I'm not going to get into it tonight. I also don't think that anyone is reading my posts here. So why should I waste my time typing in things that nobody is going to read.

(I'm waiting for someone other than liljol to tell me I'm full of shit.) :lol:

(Do NOT act on anything I've written here, without talking to your investment adviser first...!)

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